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1 point by akkartik 3877 days ago | link | parent

Hmm, my interpretation of the socket complaint (that I quoted above) was that it was a qualitative rather than a quantitative argument.

Ah, I think I've found a way to reframe what Olin Shivers is saying that helps me make sense of it. The whole 80% thing is confusing. The real problem is solutions that don't work for the very first problem you try them out at. That invariably sucks. Whereas a solution that is almost certain to support the initial use case of pretty much anyone is going to sucker in users, so that later when they run into its limitations it makes more sense to fix or enhance it rather than to shop around and then NIH ("not invented here", or reinvent) a new solution for themselves. In this way it hopefully continues to receive enhancements, thereby guaranteeing that still more users are inclined to switch to it.

:) I'm using some critical-sounding language there ("sucker") just to help highlight the core dynamic. No value judgement implied.

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I think both of us are starting with the same goal of helping hackers communicate better, share code better. But we're choosing different approaches. Your approach of fixing modularity is compatible with the Olin Shivers model, but I think both of you assume that receiving enhancements is always a good thing, and things monotonically improve. I don't buy that more and more hackers adding code and enhancements always improves things in the current world. There's a sweet spot beyond which it starts to hurt and turns away users who go off trying to NIH their own thing all over again.

My (more speculative) idea instead is to ensure more people understand the internals so that the escape hatch isn't NIH'ing something from scratch but forking from a version that is reasonable to them and also more likely to be understandable to others. By 'softening' the interface I'm hoping to make it more sticky over really long periods, more than a couple of generations. I don't think modularity will work at such long timescales.



2 points by akkartik 3872 days ago | link

I just came up with an example of my version of an "80% solution": http://www.reddit.com/r/vim/comments/22ixkq/navigate_around_...

It's not packaged up, all the internals are hanging out, some assembly is required. But it enumerates the scenarios I considered so that others can understand precisely what I was trying to achieve and hopefully build on it if their needs are concordant.

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